Saturday, December 14, 2013

Info For Men Working With St. Martha

Just a heads up for the men out there who are want to rush to work with St. Martha for your love problems. If you read my posts then you know I said that men can work with St. Martha. However, you need to be smart about it. You can petition St. Martha if your lady is stepping out on you. You can also petition her if your lady is a horrible mother and is shirking her responsibilities, like leaving them by themselves to go out to party, locking them in the car while she goes in the bar, stuff like that. St. Martha will grab that woman and shake her down real good. St. Martha don't play like that. She's old fashioned when it comes to motherhood and she don't allow that kind of stuff to fly. She does support woman and is usually on the woman's side but she don't play around with women who are dead-beat moms and just lousy mothers. She will put them in their place.

So for the men out there are who are sending me emails wanting to work with St. Martha because you think your woman is cheating on you, I would say that I guess you can but I would probably recommend working with St. Peter instead.  That's just if you want to go the route of working with a saint. St. Peter will shut those doors and close off those opportunities for her to stray so as to keep her faithful. St. Expedite can also be called upon to remove the other man and especially if you know his identity. St. Anthony can be called upon to bring her back if she has left you. You can also call upon St. Expedite to bring her back as well. If it's a hopeless situation, like it's been made real clear there is no hope at all, call on St. Jude.

16 comments:

  1. I would not advise men to petition St. Martha for cheating women unless they are married or raise kids together. St. Mary Magdalene is sometimes petitioned to change to ways of a woman who sleeps around. Of course, I don't personally believe she was really a prostitute.. the Bible was written by men, men are imperfect, and sexism was even worse back then.

    Anywho...

    This is something that many people have forgotten about working with St. Martha: No matter who you are, woman or man, you'd better be right by yourself before you go calling on her to reign somebody else in. If you're just as lazy as your husband, but you want him to work twice as hard to pamper your ass so you can be a little princess... you're in for a rude awakening. If you want her to dominate your boss just so you can slack off without being caught, don't be surprised if you find yourself called into a performance review instead.

    Now, I have to say this about punishments from saints... I grew up in a Catholic and Lutheran family, and I've heard of them punishing people, but I never, ever heard of saints killing people until I started looking at the online hoodoo community. Considering how many of them are obsessed with cursing and black magic, how many of them reject God, are hostile towards Christianity, yet still petition saints... it makes me wonder if when we hear about murderous saints, those people haven't actually been working with a demonic entity *pretending* to be that saint?

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    1. Mary Magdalene was not a prostitute. In the Bible it never actually states that she was a prostitute. This mistake results from one of the Popes who connected Mary Magdalene to an unnamed prostitute in the gospels. There's no evidence that Mary was that prostitute.

      The saints in hoodoo/conjure work are worked with differently than in standard Catholicism. Yes, the saints can kill people. That's is a standard belief. Yes, the saints can do bad things to people to. When I say that hoodoo/rootwork/conjure work is Christian I am not saying that it's the standard fundamentalist Christianity that most people are familiar with, because it's not. The Christianity in hoodoo is of the "folk religion" variety. It's loose and liberal and not strict as in say what is taught in Church. It's also more mystical in nature.

      Some of the info about saints killing people and/or harming people or doing bad things come from the Bible itself. St. Peter killed a man and a woman with a curse. It's in the bible. St. Paul blinded a man with a curse. St. Elisha cursed kids who were making fun of him for being bald and a bear came out of the woods and killed and ate the kids. Most Christians don't know about this stuff. But conjure folk read the bible and we read the bible without the pressure from the Church telling us how to interpret the Bible. We read it for ourselves and we see these stories and know that there is much stuff in the Bible that goes right over the heads of most Christians because they are spiritually blind and or have been brainwashed. Then again, most Christians don't read the Bible so they don't know what's actually there.

      St. Martha favors women, though men can work her for the correct situation. St. Peter favors men. St. Peter will kill. St. Expedite will kill and do bad stuff because he "lost his head" (decapitated) and doesn't no any better. You have to be real specific when you petition him. (St. Jude won't kill or hurt anyone but he too lost his mind because he was beaten severely in the head. So you got to be real specific with him too but he won't hurt anyone.) St. Rita favors women and kills men. She was abused by her husband and sons in life. St. Lucy favors women but will work with men if they are good people and don't try to dominate women. St. Barbara prefers women with regard to relationships but with regards to protection will protect anyone. St.Barbara hates violent men and doesn't tolerate them. St. Barbara will fuck up someone good. She too lost her head and has a temper.

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  2. Even though online it seems like everyone who does conjure works with saints, in real life a lot of conjure workers do not. Outside of Louisiana Voodoo, many conjure workers who do saint work come from denominations that include the saints. Many people in my family do conjure, I grew up with it, I thought I said this before? Anyway, that's why I mentioned the Catholic and Lutheran things, saint work isn't something I picked up later in life.

    Allow me to clarify what I mean by killing. I don't mean righteous killing or cursing. The saints will absolutely put away abusers, rapists, molestors, etc. Even Jesus laid down a curse on a fig tree just because he was hungry. That was the same day he flipped over the money changers' tables in the temple. He was all "I missed breakfast and now this shit?" Lol, Jesus is awesome.

    I mean this idea that you'll get a favor granted, but a member of your family will die. I have not heard of this in mountain folk magic, PA Dutch/powwow/granny magic, or in conjure proper. Maybe people are just repeating what they've read elsewhere online, or attributing a coincidence or two to their working with a saint?

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    1. The majority of conjure workers do not work with saints. The average conjure worker is Protestant, and usually Baptist.

      Working with the saints comes from the minority of Catholic workers and their ways date back from European methods of working with saints. Other methods were picked up or evolved on their own.

      The notion that saints can kill people, and especially if you don't keep your promise, is indeed found among those workers who work with the saints. It's even found among Mexican folk magic practitioners as well. It's a rather common belief. Not all saints are like that though. Generally it's going to be a saint with a certain reputation. If you read the Hyatt material you will find this belief is very common throughout Hyatt's material.

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    2. What region of the country is this belief most commonly found in? That saints kill members of your family in return for granting favors and kill you if you don't keep your promise? I mean, I've heard all that from people online, but people online also tend to mix and match magical traditions, fake stuff up, and be generally full of it. Also, I don't put much stock in Hyatt. Some of the people he interviewed knew what they were talking about, some didn't, and he wasn't the greatest interviewer.

      I did know about the belief existing in Mexican folk magic, but that's not conjure. I used to live in a Hispanic neighborhood, and two of my housemates practiced. Is this believe more common in south central areas?

      There are different "flavors" of conjure... West Virginia/Maryland/Delaware/Virgina is different than south Florida is different than North Carolina/South Carolina/Georgia. Not completely different, of course, just enough that you can tell where someone learned it.

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    3. If the Hyatt material the city and state is documented so you can see the locations of the belief. To the best of my memory it's pretty widespread. Where I live we have a high Hispanic community so I hear it more often with Santa Muerte. However, I've also heard it with St. Expedite. Basically the belief is that if you don't keep your promise the saint will take his own offering, which would be the life of a loved one. The moral of the story is to keep your promise. Hyatt also documents saints that will kill just because they don't like a sex, like I've heard that if you bring St. Rita into your home she might kill any males there just because she doesn't like them. In the Hyatt material there is at least one woman who claims that St. Peter burned her house down. She brought him into her home and her house caught on fire and she thinks it was due to St. Peter not liking women. You might want to read the Hyatt material for more info. As a man, I don't work with St. Rita. I also keep my promises to my saints so I don't worry about any of that stuff.

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  3. An old friend of mine had all 5 volumes as he had a thing for collecting rare books on mythology and folklore. Lucky bastard. I've picked at the books, but I never got the chance to really spend an evening curled up with with one. They're hardly short reads! I have read "Folk-lore from Adams County, Illinois" which surprisingly contains several beliefs very similar to those found in the Appalachians.

    It's just important to remember that Hyatt, while interesting, is hardly the be-all, end-all of conjure. Some of the people were just talking about what a conjure worker they went to did (they themselves didn't actually understand conjure), some people were just clueless, and I felt like a few people seemed to be trying to how much bullshit they could spin before Hyatt caught on. It really bothers me how many people use Hyatt's material like a conjure Bible. I'll mention something about persimmon bark or crown vetch or jack in the pulpit, only to be blasted with "THOSE PLANTS AREN'T USED IN HOODOO. THEY'RE NOT MENTIONED IN HYATT'S WORK. NO HOODOO STORES SELL THEM. NOPE, YOU'RE WRONG." Ugh, idiots.

    Sadly, I can't find HVCW in any libraries. There is a site online selling pdfs for a very reasonable price and it looks pretty legit, I'm tempted to try it out. I wouldn't be out much money if it turns out to be a bust. Judging by their member forums, I could at least spend my credits on other popular book titles if the Hyatt files don't work.

    Yeah, not keeping your promise to a saint or spirit is stupid. Why, oh WHY, do people do that?

    You know, I have to say that I *have* wondered if St. Jude accelerated the cancer and death of my horribly abusive ex's father so that he would leave the country suddenly, giving me the opportunity to quickly pack and escape.

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  4. I think a lot of people are trying to rip people of with charging ridiculously high prices for the volumes. I found a site selling pdfs for the same price as the real volumes, which is kind of absurd. Then there are people who want like $2500 per volume, which is a total scam.

    As far as St. Jude goes, he's always been a gentle spirit to me. I wouldn't even begin to feel right asking him to harm someone.

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  5. http://www.sacred-magick.com/download/search.php?txtsrc=harry+middleton+hyatt&Send=Search+Library

    They cost 300 credits each, and $39 buys you 1500 worth of credits.

    I didn't ask him to harm anyone, I asked him to liberate me. I didn't want to call on St. Rita because there were 5 other males in the house who were totally blasé about the severe abuse. I just didn't want all those people being hurt, even if it was justified. Every day I feared for my life; I just wanted to be free.

    The only other saint I was working with during that time was St. Barbara. I really don't think she had anything to do with the father. I was working with her for protection and to make sure I died right, not at the hands of my ex.

    You mentioned St. Lucy above, have you worked with her before? I'm working on building a relationship with her because my eyesight has also been damaged due to violence. Her feast day was actually a few days ago.

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  6. Wow, that's seems to be a good deal on the Hyatt volumes. The only pdf's I've seen are from people selling them for hundreds of dollars and the hardbacks for thousands. Every now and then someone will pop up selling individual volumes for like $100-$300, which is what they should be going for.

    St. Lucy is good. She favors women. She will work with men but they have to approach her in the correct manner, you know, they have to be a good guy. St Lucy is for the eyes but she more commonly used in hoodoo/conjure work for psychic empowerment, to hide or uncover the truth of a situation, for visions, and protection, especially hiding from one's enemies. My eyesight is getting worse too, so I'll be working more closely with her in the coming years. She tends to be a no nonsense and rather serious spirit. Things have to be real tidy with her as well. She doesn't like clutter and her altar space has to be pristine.

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  7. Yeah, second sight. I already have that, actually, along with other psychic gifts/curses. My place is so cluttered... I can't throw anything out, I just feel sorry for things and let them stay. My altars are both very orderly, however. Lucy's eyes were gouged and then miraculously restored, and since not even neuro-opthalmologists have been able to figure out what's wrong with my eyes or fix them, I chose her over any other healer figure.

    Since I work with several traditions that are interrelated, sometimes I can't be unsure exactly where the lines are drawn. Like, I'm pretty sure working by the almanac is purely mountain and powwow... or was it once used in conjure as well? It's this sort of stuff that interests me most about reading Hyatt's books in their entirety.

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  8. Doc, I feel like it's absurd to think that a saint would kill you or someone else just because the have a fit for not getting an offering, Saints are exalted and are close to Christ and intercede for us. Why would Jesus/divinity/Spirit let a saint carelessly kill someone? It sounds like some spirits will hide behind the saint or spirit we might think that we're talking to. Can you help me understand? Thank you, Andre

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    1. Andre, it's quite common for this belief. As I told Dr. Trixie above, go read the Hyatt material. It's there. Plus this belief is not just found among hoodoo/conjure work but is also among the Mexican folk magic practitioners as well.

      As I wrote above, St. Peter while alive put a death curse on 2 people and killed them. St. Paul blinded a man. St. Elisha cursed a bunch of kids and they where then killed and eaten by a bear. This is all in the Bible. The saints can and do kill people. I'm not saying that all saints will do this. There are just some saints that develop this reputation.

      Again, don't believe what I say. Go read the Hyatt material. It's there quite frequently for various saints, that if you don't keep your promise they will take a loved one as their offering. Again, not all saints are like this. It's just the ones that have that reputation.

      Finally, I need to reinforce this. Perhaps I need to write a separate blog on this. Just because hoodoo/conjure work is Christian doesn't mean it is fundamentalist Christian or the typical teaching. It's not. This is "folk religion". It's not strict. Be good a person and have love in your heart and you are good to go. It's also quite mystical. It's not dogmatic. It's not strict. It doesn't have formalities. We conjure workers aren't Sunday School Teachers, Priests or Pastors. What I teach has nothing to do with what is being preached at over at St. Mary's or the First Church of Christ. Understand?

      So when we work with the saints it's only a little bit similar to how the Catholics work with saints. Who are the saints? Spirits of the dead. So we are working with these spirits and each spirit has it's own temperament and likes and dislikes, as well as stuff they are good at and stuff they are not so good at. A lot of this stuff probably evolved with time.

      Am I saying that if you don't keep your promise that you will be killed by the saint? No, no I am not. I'm saying that some saints have this reputation. If you don't keep your work then most saints will cut you off or take your luck away or something like that. It's not like it is the Catholic Church where the saints are always forgiving even if you don't keep your promise.

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    2. Unknown, you'll find that even conjure workers who go to church faithfully don't just go by what the preacher tells them the Bible says. They read the Bible and interpret it for themselves. There is a LOT of fucked. up. stuff. in the Bible. Lots of horrible stuff done in Gods name and praised. Even Moses encouraged the rape and murder of conquered peoples. The Gnostics had a lot of interesting theories on this. See: God as a demiurge.

      Anyway, don't misinterpret my post above as me believing that all saints are gentle lambs. They are not, they will kill if it is just. And what I mean by that is, they're not going to kill someone for you because that person called you stupid. In that case, I do believe some of the more unstable ones just might turn against YOU for having murderous intent.

      No. when people who are witches (people who do unjustified black magic) leave out the flowers and water and food offered, but the saint still kills a family member or them, I do wonder if they were working with a dark spirit in disguise. There is another possibility. Considering how many saints were martyred, some may punish those who receive a favor/miracle but still do not convert. It's just an idea. I can believe the death of the practitioner more than I can the death of an innocent family member though, that just seems so ghoulish.

      Again Doc, remember, Hyatt didn't really differentiate between conjure and witchcraft. This is one of the reasons I think he wasn't a very good interviewer. I remember going through various sections and I'd come to something that was very obviously witchcraft/black magic, and you could tell the informant was trying to convey to Hyatt that it was something OTHER PEOPLE (witches, hint hint) DO, but Hyatt would be either oblivious to the coded language or not interested in putting it in its own section. So some accounts of saintly vengeance may indeed be against witches.

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    3. Dr. Trixie, some saints can and will do nasty stuff to people, even if it's not deserved. St. Expedite, for example, will fuck people up. They say it's because he lost his head (decapitated) and doesn't know any better. I'm just saying.

      Trixie, I'm the one who wrote that Hyatt didn't differentiate between conjure and witchcraft.

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    4. Hmm. I just know there's a lot of people poking around where they have no business, then and now. I'll admit that my unwillingness believe in saints killing for absolutely no reason stems from my own religious beliefs. I believe that many, many times people have thought they were speaking to God but were instead speaking to an evil being. Because if God really condones the rape of women, brothels as punishment, the subjugation of women... well then to paraphrase Epicurus, if he is able but unwilling to prevent evil, then he is malevolent. In my opinion, if it contradicts something Jesus said, it is worthless. The Bible was recorded by imperfect men and it is about imperfect men. I don't want to debate religion, just trying to help you understand where I'm coming from here.

      Oh Doc, there have been numerous times where you've posted exactly what I've been thinking or have thought in the past. This is partly why I like you <3

      The coded language is REALLY REALLY obvious, I think the only reason it doesn't bother the professional plagiarizers is because there's money to be made, and it doesn't jump out at most of the CERTIFIED INTERNET HOODOOS because they think everything it witchcraft and witches are good and no one is allowed to use the original definition of witch.

      I'll give Hyatt this, he's certainly not the only one to have done it. It doesn't make it right... well, actually, maybe he doesn't get a pass, because most other books I've read with first and second-hand accounts of witchcraft only claimed to be about "folk-beliefs".

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